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It seems to me that tefillah as a communal act via the minyan is a man\'s primary vehicle, what is the parallel for women? MF: + 
They do have a clear role though - spiritual agitation. Call it holy sublimation. Traditionally this was the yeshiva bachur. Today it\'s the highly educated 30 something? MF: + 
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Tefilla As A Family Value

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what about the primary kavan of tefillah being v\'ahavta l\'reicha comocha? MF: + 
[M8]: Are women & men different? Is women's relationship to HKBH different as related to tefilla?
GR: + 
[M5]: Heteronormative family structure?
GR: + 
It can feel like an individual's tefilla, without a family/ 'bayt,' is a bit like one hand clapping--that Judaism is structured for nuclear heteronormative (re M5) families and doesn't know what to do with people who don't fit that model. Or even to say it the other way, people who aren't embedded in family don't have a clear place in Jewish life. MM: + 
[M3 on M6]: My wife also expresses a desire that she wants to be getting to shul more, to experience it mitzad her husband; [shul] is part of my life that she hasn't really yet encountered so much, because of her involvement with the kids.
GR: + 
[M5 and M9] David Deida is relevant to understanding male roles, gender polarity
GR: + 
[M3]: This issue of feminism and what's a woman's role and what a man's role -- and this is coming from personal experience, not that I am such a strong feminist anyway, but -- I am starting to realize that the priorities that I have now as a married man and a father of four are obviously not only much different and have evolved so much from when I was single, but also my perspectives on a woman's place in shul and yidishkeit in general has changed somewhat. GR: + 
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[M4]: Conflict vs. complement; men vs. women; obligation vs. experience; house vs. shul; tradition vs. changing roles; personal identity vs. family; private decisions vs. public image; together in prayer vs. mechitza; feminism~ equality vs. gender
GR: + 
[M4]: ..[my wife] has a strong desire to experience tefillah b'Tzibor at Hallel... and there's a halachic consideration which gives me primacy [to go instead of her]. GR: + 
Not everyone is married with a family. In the name of (M13), 'Don't treat me like half a person just because I'm single.' MM: + 
[M6 on M4]: ..the sense of primacy is very present for me, even more than gedolah metzuveh mi'she aino metzuveh. The person who is commanded to do it, it's a greater thing. It's stronger than that in the relationship of the man to tefillah, certainly b'zman... and I do think there is a certain sense of chashivus  to the man or for me, having a sense of well being and shleymus in terms of my davening in a tzibur in terms of being connected to kehilla, having a sense of kevius...
GR: + 
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Contributors:
MF:Michael Feuer, GR:Gemara Redactor, MM:Matthew Mausner
Family is essential to my tefillah.  Logistics, breadth of emotion, and brokenness of heart are places where they touch.
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[M7, M6 in name of M7]: "My idea of right isn't the only idea of right." Presence of another will.
GR: + 
[M3]: For me, family is essential to my tefilla just as a part of the tefilla itself. 'Please, Ribono Shel Olam, let today go smoothly, that everything with the kids should go well...' GR: + 
[M4]: I remember I had this interaction with a couple that were in the midst of a divorce, and one of her big ta'anot was that she mammish felt that her husband was using shul as an excuse to be out of the house; like, times of the highest tension. GR: + 
[M6 on M4]: That's why it's called Shalom Bayt. 'Shalom, [waving while leaving] Bayt!'
GR: + 
[M2]: I remember when our kids were born and we were in the hospital, we were parents for the first time and we had no idea what to do- what do we do? Now we have kids, great, what happens next?  GR: + 
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[M1]: How much of a value is it for me to daven at tzibur and how much of a value is it for me to be present so that things in my house can be calm, loving, and more functional? GR: + 
[M3]:..my wife says to me, 'I want you to bring in a certain type of Torah into the house'; well the time has to be allocated to that, and yet it becomes challenging when she also wants that I am home at certain times [for the kids], and then davening and then Torah learning as a priority, how much of what I am doing is taking away from the overall dynamic or adding to it...
GR: + 
[M9]: Some people are on their way into more observance, and some people are on their way out and different levels of burnout; and that's a factor in some... divorced couples, that the wife was like 'hey I don't value this as much as you do', or 'I want you to be working more, I don't want you to be learning Torah.' The married guys that are here [in the yeshiva], I gather that your wives are pretty supportive of you davening, of you learning Torah.  I don't think those are givens in the Jewish world.
GR: + 
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[M5]: Yishuv ha Da'at: How does family affect this?
GR: + 
[M5 on M7] How loving a family affects davening- the sensitivity developed by these circumstances, softening of in the face of another will, the closer the greater the effect, who's closer than G-d?
GR: + 
[M5 from M1] Acceptance of failure within relationship, courage not to walk away.  Committment.
GR: + 
[M3]: I find that going to shul with my family is more of a challenge; forget about actually fufilling my chiyuv of davening, it's more just keeping everything else in a good place, vis-a-vis my wife and her interactions with the kids, [dealing with] the kids themselves. GR: + 
[M6 on M7]: You can't change a diaper while you're laining.
GR: + 
[M7]: No, you really can't, because you have to look at the words.
GR: + 
[M2 on M7]: Come on, you can change a diaper without looking!
GR: + 
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